[roundel]

Originally Posted by N0tt0N

I think we need a three-man team relay with cars and guns at BSR... A lap around Main to the range with rifles, a lap around Shen egress passenger side to the shoot house, a lap around Jeff and some driver side targets on the skidpad.

I like this idea. Add some clays. I like to shoot moving targets more than paper.

[Vicegrip]

Originally Posted by smdubovsky

Oh boy here comes the chevy vs ford arguments... I have an opinion too:P

Not sure where one gets the idea the 226 is "not all that accurate". In a ransom rest it should outshoot a glock. Also, might want to tell the people who are winning competitions w/ the P226 (X5 comp) that their gun is no good as a target pistol Target guns are never plastic. The extra mass of a metal frame makes them bobble less for a smoother sight picture and have less felt recoil. For the guys shooting hundreds/thousands of rounds an outing the latter adds up. A metal frame moves less under temp/tolerance/ext forces so a trigger can be tuned lighter too.

The P226, CZ75, etc are all guns w/ good palm swells. Glock and other plastic frames typ have 2x4 slab sided grips. FWIW, Target guns never have flat sides. 2x4 is slim for carry but pretty lousy for fit. *ALL* of them will outshoot the majority of users so can't really say one if better than the other for that. All should also be dead reliable. No excuse for a modern handgun being less than 100%.

Disclaimer: I own a G17 w/ a lightened trigger. Also have a XDM 5.25 w/ a full PRP trigger for USPSA competition. (Im a bit of a trigger whore.) Neither can touch a good sig 226/beretta 92/cz 75/1911 as target guns. I do not own a 226 but have shot many. I do not own a 226 but its superior in nearly every way to a glock other than size/weight. If I was a cop/soldier who had to carry everyday, hands down the glock. No contest. But for a gun that goes to the range in a bag to have fun/compete with? Sig every time.

x2 adult airguns. If someone is looking I have a few extra I should prob sell. Diana 5/10/75, Crosman 600s, Beemans, FWB602 are all things I have duplicates of and could thin the herd.

To get back on topic: I keep thinking we should have a dorki range day. Find a laid back public range and blow some stuff up. Would be a great time and possibly get a few new people introduced to the sport. Its cheaper than DE (sorta)

Edit: Oh, I'm also in the buckmark camp

I should have been a bit more clear. I don't think any stock, holster carry defense type pistol is target pistol. I also noted "out of the box". Not Ford or Chevy but car or truck with brand not a first consideration. I shot practical not bench rest target. With pistols consistent lock up between the barrel and slide is key not so much slide and frame. With practical that the gun goes off, recycles and speed of reload is key.

A much better post from me would have been "I don't think a Sig is a good first pistol. Big and Busy with too much to think about." Dead reliable = Glock. YMMV.

Do tell on the Diana-75 please.

[Cliff Claven]

Originally Posted by N0tt0N

The ergo grip on some of the H&Ks is really nice if it fits your hand perfectly.

H&K, now you’re talking. so well made. honestly i prefer my H&Ks to my sigs. but that doesn’t mean i love my sigs any less. (and i fully favor my 551-A1 over any AR15....)

but, back to the OP, a P226 is a great way to start. a very nice handgun. you can’t go wrong with a sig. you’ll have no regrets. and you can always sell it to someone else if you grow tired or just find you prefer something less refined like a glock. many variants of the p226 available, all nice, but i’d highly recommend a threaded barrel and eventually picking up a suppressor. suppressor is the polite way to shoot.

x3 on the air rifle, btw! lots of fun and lethal to varmints.

[Dr K]

How much does a suppressor reduce the volume? What the approx. dB at 20 feet be with/without the suppressor (on the p226, for example)?

[N0tt0N]

With a pillow over their face or without?

[smdubovsky]

Originally Posted by Dr K

How much does a suppressor reduce the volume? What the approx. dB at 20 feet be with/without the suppressor (on the p226, for example)?

A lot Don't know at 20' but most will approach 40dB reduction @ 1m. Completely hearing safe and the gun cycling starts to be the majority of the noise. 147gr subsonic loads are even quieter esp if there are nearby objects that reflect sound back at you (in an open field supersonic loads aren't much louder but at an indoor range they still have quite a bit of 'bark'.) Its not holywood quiet if thats your only experience w/ suppressors.

[smdubovsky]

Originally Posted by Vicegrip

Do tell on the Diana-75 please.

I think I'm up to three of them. Even after I took lots of disassembly pics I had to buy a 2nd one so I could put the first back together Only the germans could make clockwork that complicated. Its a beautiful thing. I'll look at my notes and see if the others are rebuilt. The orig seals turn to dust after this long. But I have the repair info now and the spring rod tool to keep from kinking the springs. BTDT once I'll send you an email w/ details.

[Vicegrip]

Thanks. Call me sick but the clockwork aspect is one of the aspects that seems to be calling to me. It seems they are like air cooled cars in they can be rebuilt and tuned as needed and are classic in form. Am giving up pistols as it seems my iron sight days are over. Looking at a PCP setup for the tune/scope/body/mind OCD as well.

[scpx]

Vicegrips advice is sound. I am a former firearms trainer and sell firearms for a living. I do not care WHAT the brand is, if the gun does not fit you, you will never really care for it or get good with it. You can certainly ADAPT to it. but it may never please you the way a pistol might that actually fits your hand well. So this really is not a Ford v. Chevy thing at all. Most civilian shooters latch onto a brand just like car guys latch onto car brands and stick with them. This does not always mean they are the best choice, but it keeps the bragging rights wars going on forever. You see the same thing in the 9mm v. 45 ACP arguments. I know known people who have actually had to SHOOT people, with both calibers and what happened afterward had way more to do with the mindset of the guy getting shot than what any idiot gun writer tells you to believe based on is paper punching experience. but that is, frankly, a boring topic so I will leave that one alone for those who still like arguments for arguments sake, LOL.

Anyway, as far as SIG goes, yes, reliable choice, good firearm. Popular. But it is large, unwieldy for some, and somewhat ungainly for others. It might fit you perfectly. And that is what I want you to take away from my poorly phrased commentary. No matter how good a product may be, if it does not fit, don't waste your money on it. Get something that does, even something not suggested by the masses. I for instance, used a Browning Hi Power for years because it fit ME well. I switched to a CZ-75 later because it fit even better and held more ammo. I won a fair number of IDPA competitions with it, but none of these combat style guns are what one would call Match Grade target guns. They are fine for competition like Defensive Pistol matches. Excellent actually. But if you are just into Bullseye, then a tuned 1911 (assuming it fits, it may not) may be what you want, or a gun specifically developed for accuracy versus combat reliability. A gun that shoots a 2 inch group at 25 yards is no better than a gun that shoots a 4 inch group in terms of defensive shooting. But for Bullseye competition, you might need that. For the defensive arts types of competition, any of the 9mm wonder guns will work for you and are easy to master, again, assuming proper fit.

I now return you to your regular programming.

[deutschkar]

I looked at the 226 when I was in search of the one. Held the cz75d and have never looked back. Now they have safety's on them so if that's a thing for you search for an older model. When I fire other peoples pistols I feel a little sorry for them.