[ttrew]

Dave - For the record, Potomac does have a tool kit with spare tow eyes, extra snatch straps, etc. Being the first event of the year, it seems the kit did not make it's way to the tow truck before we needed it. Like so many things in life, that oversight was fixed AFTER we needed it.

[BlackTalon]

Maybe tow points can be pointed out to the car owners at future tech inspections? Heck, I'm still not sure where to hook up my Carrera in the back... So I know if I'm about to go off, I need to snap into a 180 degree turn before I hit the gravel

[TD in DC]

Originally Posted by BlackTalon

Maybe tow points can be pointed out to the car owners at future tech inspections?

Yeah, that is what I am envisioning. You roll up to tech, and the inspector asks: "where is your tow hook?" I predict that 90% of the drivers will say "I dunno" At that point, you will have to have a little conversation. Well, on most 964s, . . . " The bottom line is that you don't get through tech unless you (1) have your tow hooks attached to your car; or (2) if you have no tow hook, you can articulate a reasonable alternative to the tech guy. After the first time you do this, I doubt it will take a second . . .

[BlackTalon]

Not at grid tech -- at the shop tech inspection, when the car is on the lift (since not all have screw-on eyebolt attachment points)

[TD in DC]

Originally Posted by BlackTalon

Not at grid tech -- at the shop tech inspection, when the car is on the lift (since not all have screw-on eyebolt attachment points)

I think it needs to be at grid tech. Take a 996 for example. The owner either needs to have the tow hitch screwed into the bumper already, or he or she needs to show it to you when asked so that you see it is in the car. Again, if you don't have a tow hook, then the driver can say, I want to get towed out by attaching to the "x". So long as x is reasonable, he or she is cleared and free to roll.

TD

[VaSteve]

Originally Posted by TD in DC

I think it needs to be at grid tech. Take a 996 for example. The owner either needs to have the tow hitch screwed into the bumper already, or he or she needs to show it to you when asked so that you see it is in the car. Again, if you don't have a tow hook, then the driver can say, I want to get towed out by attaching to the "x". So long as x is reasonable, he or she is cleared and free to roll.

TD

I see a couple of problems with this:

A. We are told to take all stuff out of the car before grid teching. Maybe the eye is left at home.
B. Grid tech is a little late to find out that something is amiss. I consider GT to be almost a slam dunk....helmet approved, haven't toasted your brakes in the past week, took the floor mats out, etc. To black flag someone at this point after they are already time/money invested in the event is too late for something as small at a tow eye. Having drivers climbing out of their cars looking for something to tow by on the grid is also time consuming/dangerous.

Many on this board are reasonable people. I don't know if anyone recalls the guy that blew a radiator hose on his 996 at the HPDC in April 04. This guy had a meltdown when he couldn't find a replacement hose at OG Racing. (Really knew a lot about the car, eh?) Then he got all worked up because his uber low ground effects couldn't make it onto the AAA wrecker. I can only imagine this kind of a guy having a coronary trying to figure out what to tow from underneath the car while there at the GT.

Figure it out when the car is on the lift....this gives people a week to find an eye if their car accomodates or some other alternative. A pop-quiz at 7:30 on a Saturday is unfair.

[}{arlequin]

i think focusing on the tow hooks is taking us away from the point of this....

seems like we've latched onto the towhook idea as if it will solve all the problems.
yes, make them a requirement and we will be able to prevent LOSS time.
now how about going back to figuring out how the club can PROVIDE more time?

[TntPorsche]

I haven't visited here in quite some time and while I hesitate to tread into Dorki territory, there are so many interesting points in this thread that I just can't help myself.

(By the way - HI Betty!)

As the retired track chair for NNJR, I have a lot of thoughts on the organization of DE events. I do want to mention that NNJR truly appreciated the Dorki/Potomac support at our SP and Shenandoah events last year and hope to see you folks again this year.

I think organizers have to take a lot into consideration . . . we all want to max track time . . . we all want to accomodate the new drivers and do everything we can not to turn newbies off or away . . . and, most importantly, we all want to run SAFE events.

Every region has a different set of circumstances and based on those circumstances the regions all make different decisions. NNJR does not run less than 4 runs a day and they run 24-30 minutes each. There are some events where we run five run groups . . . generally Pocono and Lime Rock. At Pocono, we also run two upper run group days. Last year at the Glen, I was way oversubscribed in the upper run groups . . . the only way to get in all the drivers that had applied was to add a run group . . . not fair to those who expected 4 runs a day. I called the Glen and to my surprise, I was able to purchase more track time. The event wound up making less money with the extra run group but . . . everyone had 4 full length runs and I was able to accommodate everyone who applied.

Pocono is our home track . . . it is close and therefore it brings out a lot of students . . . One good thing about Pocono is that there is a long track day 8:30 to 6. Lime Rock is not a longer day but you can hire an extra flagger and run through lunch. At all other tracks, we don't have as many students so we are not forced to run five groups. I guess some would say that having Pocono as your home track with long hours is a blessing but I would much prefer to have SP in my own backyard.

Additionally, because Pocono is our home track, we have always travelled. When we first go to a new track, participation is light. In most cases, participation grows over the first few years until we get to a point where we run 4 good sized groups. We have tried on and off for years to get an event going at SP but most of our people are used to running on weekends. Since our SP date is a weekday, it will continue to be a light event and most likely we will run three groups. Shenandoah on a weekend will probably attrack a fair number of our trackies and likely will be a four run group event.

NNJR has been criticized for having work assignments . . . they are a half day and are likely to stay . . . there are a lot of reasons for this but this post is long enough.

So - why do people choose the events they attend?

There are many answers to that question. I choose events for a number of reasons . . . I like to drive so I like to get a reasonable amount of track time . . . I like to see friends I have met from various regions so sometimes I choose an event where there is less driving but the event brings out a wide variety of participants. I like the safety guidelines of some organizations better than others so I do avoid some events. I like to instruct but I prefer to have only one student . . . no problem jumping in an upper run group car . . . but prefer having only one assigned student. I would much prefer to pay for an event as an instructor than attend a "free event" and not have much driving time or have multiple students.

We all have choices . . . for some the choices are harder. You who are blessed with SP as a home track face some difficult decisions balancing track time with tons of applications. I don't envy that position. This is probably the only discussion where having Pocono as a home track could be considered a plus.

Hope to see you all at some point this season! Maybe I will even get to a Potomac event if you guys will have me!

[Rick Lee]

Thanks Arlene! NNJR got a bit of a bad rap a few yrs. ago on Pelican with the work assignments. But I worked the tech line at your Shenandoah DE last Oct. and it was WELL WORTH the huge track time I got. I might see you guys at your July Pocono DE and will definitely see you at Shenandoah in Oct.

[TD in DC]

Originally Posted by }{arlequin

i think focusing on the tow hooks is taking us away from the point of this....

seems like we've latched onto the towhook idea as if it will solve all the problems.
yes, make them a requirement and we will be able to prevent LOSS time.
now how about going back to figuring out how the club can PROVIDE more time?

No, it is not an answer to all the questions, but, as you point out, it is one way of preventing loss of a precious resource. As you well know, I am down with providing more time as well.

That said, if you can't get your $hit together with respect to something as little as a tow hook or towing points, then you don't belong on the track . . . The whole point is that you must have your tow hook WITH you when you are on the track (not back in the paddock) OR you need to know how to live without it which is as easy as knowing where you can attach a hook to your frame in an emergency. Very simple. I have very little sympathy on this issue.