[swftiii]

Dirk I,

I'm considering a 997.1 which will be primarily used for the street, but hope to be able to get some track time in at some point in the future. As you know there are a lot of discussions about the IMS Bearing on the 997.1 engines (06-08) and opinions. There are plenty of 997.1's participating in DE and CR, so what has been done to address the concern to make the engines more reliable or to overcome the concern?

I know the 997.2 would be a recommendation, but is more than I want to spend. So, should I find a well maintained 06-08, an 05 with LN fix, or stay away?

Thanks,
-Skip

[Carrera51]

I am by no means and expert on this, but it seems that the low mileage garage queens that spend most of their lives being lugged around town at low RPM while getting the oil changed every 10K miles are the ones more prone to having engine issues. I know of a 1998 Boxster with over 200K miles on it that has never had the engine dropped for IMS or RMS replacement. Original owner drove the car as a daily driver basically year round.

Good Hands raced his ex Koni Challenge 996 for 4 years on the same M96 engine. So at least from where I am sitting, it seems the ones that get driven and driven hard on occasion seem to have fewer of the know failures than low mileage cars that are babied.

[ruffyz]

This is hard one to answer.

The Internet is some help, but there is a lot of opinion on the internet and some fact. It is very hard tell the two apart.

I have a 996 that I split miles on with my 944 year round. My current plan is to drive the car and not worry about it.

Personally, I don't buy into the aftermarket mumbojumbi. Not that it isn't a concern and I'm sure ln et al have good products, but the Porsche community is prone to obesessing. But then again, replacement Porsche motors aren't cheap...

[88carrera]

Merry Christmas everyone:

Skip,

I was recently in the same position as you: back and forth between a 2005-2008 or get a 2009.

I have decided I will take the plunge in 2016 with a 2009. The 2009's are still more expensive but I can't take a chance on possibly spending $15,000+ for a new engine/rebuild. (My realized savings for buying an older model have just evaporated).

With the M96/97 engine the real concern is not IMS but bore scoring. The the 9A1 so far has been very well received and we are now coming up on seven years. I haven't heard of any major chronic issue.

At least I have peace of mind and not that sinking feeling that any engine issue may be IMS or bore scoring. And if catastrophe does occur whether to spend money replacing an engine in a 9, 10, 11 year old chassis.

It's a shame that I have to exclude the '05-'08 for what is otherwise a terrific car and a pcar bargain.

I know there a lots of people driving them with nary a problem, but financially it's easier (safer) for me to spend more now (and finance a bigger note) than to scrape together $15,000+ if it happens.

My .02 cents.

[Trak Ratt]

What Mark said! Then again any with the update OR get one and have the updates done. Any purchase should include at least checking the oil filter. Don't have to change al the oil to check either.

[swftiii]

Thanks all and keep any comments coming.

I keep jumping back and forth. The reason is that I feel I can sell the 964 and with a couple extra bucks get into a well optioned 997.1 for my liking. I don't anticipate any track time for the next few years, but will be driving the Porsche often on the street - it will be my daily driver either in DC or FL (need a car in both locations).

I don't want to spend more to reach the 997.2 price range, unless I can get $5k more out of the 964 than I think I will be able to...guess we'll have to see about that.

I miss track time with the Dorki's and the logistical setup I had in NOVA, but life marches on and kids are only around for a few years before they don't even want to be with you or are even living at home, so they are top priority for the next 5 or so years.

Keep your thoughts coming to help me decide.

-Skip

[N0tt0N]

So, the challenge of an 'updated' IMS on an M97 is it requires an engine tear down, unlike the earlier M96. Good news is the M97 is far less likely to have an IMS failure when compared to the M96 with certain years and models being worse. Bad news is all are considered disposable as they lack many design features that would make longevity maintenance easier (or possible in some cases) when compared to the Mezger (GT3, Turbo), for instance.

On the street the 996 is the best value as a daily driver especially if you aren't planning heavy track usage as you say.

Also, given Porsche's design history I am still awaiting the DFI engines to reach the decade point for any longevity claims.

Also, keep the 964 for the five years and buy a beach house.

[ruffyz]

I agree with everyine so far, but I think "disposable" is a bit strong when it comes to m96/m97 motors. The problem is the cost of putting an new engine in, in the unlikely event of a catastrophic failure.

I also agree that 996 is the better value if you can find a good looking one (read widebody). Don't forget to consider a turbo either.

All and all I think if you are mechanically inclined, saving a handful of cash and dealing with a 10+ year old car (996 or 997) with minor chance of engine swap is a good value. Otherwise, I dunno.

[vascott99]

With the prices of the early 911's rising at crazy amounts and that includes the 964. I would hold onto it for a few more years and then be able to by the 997 of your choice with enough left over to have it race prepped or as Ruffyz mentioned. Get a 996 Turbo.

[spiffyjiff]

just to be clear, M96/97 do not denote years, they denote the size - in the carrera model, 2005-08, M96 was the 3.6, M97 the 3.8.

IMO, the problem is overblown. yes it can happen, yes it's catastrophic but relatively speaking, it's an incredibly small number out there that have had IMS issues. there's plenty other (oiling) issues that our engines encounter which the GT's/turbos (i.e. the Mezgers) don't have to deal with, given their design - scoring, D-chunk, G-load oil starvation, etc. my '06 C2S has 60k+ miles and 100+ track days. yeah, it's got issues but IMS isn't one of them.

that being said, if all you want to spend is 997.1 money, then find a good example, have a reputable shop do a PPI, make a deal and drive it like you stole it. otherwise look into a 996 turbo which may be around the same price.