[Chopper Dropper]

Pretty well covered the ground here. One last thought, I instruct, my a**s is in the seat and body will meet the wall at the same time as the irrational student. I hope all instructors whether PCA or any other group have a certain sense of self preservation and will control and guide their student or if neccessary send them home. When I instructed helicopters, at least I had dual controls and never met a student I could not take the controls away from.No such luxury on the track,so one has to be on the watch. As for different marques, it really does not matter.Some ones Corrola may be as much of an investment to him/her as a new GT3 may be to a PCA member. As for getting dusted off, so what! I have seen cheap 914s getting passing signals from all sorts of high powered equipment. I have been blown off many times on the road by Hondas Kias and anything else that may want to "race".
The best passing signals I have come across were at Mosport where there were no run groups, everyone students/instructors, profesional drivers in anything from stock old Golfs to Vipers, GT3> Trains dissipated quicker than at most PCA events in all groups.
Dirk

[nova996]

Originally Posted by APKhaos

There is no such thing as bad track time.

You're probably right about that. Good motto to live by when I make weekend plans from now on!

[Trak Ratt]

I was feeling really smug in my superiority to all those “other guys” That is until I remembered how glade I was that Marc made white & how I was looking forward to lining up behind him on the grid Boys & their toys, the older I get, the faster I was

[bettyc]

've seen cheap 914s getting passing signals from all sorts of high powered equipment.

The cheapest thing about my teener was the purchase price! Who are possibly referring to Dirk?

[MBuck951]

Originally Posted by nova996

I meant "serious" about learning, as opposed to guys taking a street race out on to the track. Or just joyriding instead of trying to actually get better. I had heard that some drivers were reluctant to give passes when certain "rival" cars were out there, that sort of thing. Or people overdriving, over aggressive.

Never done a FATT, but I know what you're talking about.

I recently drove @ BeaveRun with the Integra Type-R Club. 80 cars at the event in 4 run groups, 65 of the 80 were Type-R's of various modification. While I certainly had a good time, there was definately a lot of the above mentioned activities going on. Virtually eveyone but me had a camera mounted in their car to capture the "action". I almost want to say some people thought it was a race, not DE.

Amazingly enough there were no huge incidents, but I'm still on the fence about running with them again and/or steppng outside of PCA in the near future.

I prefer how Potomac and other PCA regions I've run with do things, thanks!

[forklift]

Hey Guys,

Just to add a few comments and reiterate others. I have been to almost every FATT for the last year and have seen no serious accidents. Usually there are 2-3 “offs,” but I saw that at the PCA and Mazda events I went to this year. The only car I have seen totaled this year (had to be close to totaled anyway) was a GT3 at the last Summit Shantenbaum (sp.) event. This is not to say that it was a dangerous event, quite the contrary as Shatenbaum was probably the best day I had all year. It is just that bad things can and do happen with all organizations. Over the last year I personally have not seen anyone driving so aggressively that I would call it dangerous or irresponsible, although I know it happens. People exceed their limits, but that happens everywhere.

Some are late to give a pass but that also is common with different groups. There was a recent thread on Rennlist discussing this. There are only two cars this year I can think of that refused to give a passing signal: one blue Z06 (Corvette Syndrome) and some antique Lotus, both Group 2, I got the Lotus black flagged.

IMO, PCA is a better value, but I find FATT more convenient as if you are in Group 2, you can usually just show up and get a spot (good for rain and not staying up until 1 am to register). I see no difference in safety and BSR will quickly black flag any dangerous behavior. I like seeing and driving with all of the great Porsches at the PCA events, but it is also cool driving with other makes as well. Just as with the PCA events (only been to three, one of them being Potomac), most everyone is pleasant and shares a deep passion for performance driving.

Hey John,

Are you in the black SC? I just started instructing this past FATT and had a great time. My first student was a kid (19?) in a WRX. He did very well for the first time out and had a great attitude. Cliff did have a student that was overdriving the car, and said he had to rein him in a bit.

Hope to see some of you guys out there. Once you get signed off for Group 2, which is probably equal to White and up, you are eligible for Seat Times. These are timed events and have very little traffic and tons of track time (5 twenty minute sessions) with no pre-registration – arrive and drive. I hope to hit VIR with Potomac/Zone 2 in ’05. I wanted to go to the upcoming Potomac VIR, but can’t make it. I might go to the NNJR VIR later this year.

Jim

P.S. I have a video camera, but use it to watch line consistency and throttle application. I find it very useful……

[Alan Herod]

Another note to add to jim's - Dirk, John Brown, and I all instructed at the past FATT weekend. Safety and fun seemed to be the top priorities and it was a very well run event. On the issue of vehicle safety, most of the cars are up to the safety standard of Potomac events; however, tech is much more cursory, and is performed at the track. We were not assigned students; but, picked our cars once they were lined up. My first car was somewhat of a baptism of sorts. I thought, 'Hey there's a early Z car (260Z); one of the cars I raced in a past-life in SCCA.' -- what fun I hop in the car and start to ask questions about the students experience. First time on the track, first sports car, -- Ok -- I'll drive the car the first two laps and show you the line at very modest speeds. Switch seats -- 'oh, oh, what is that deep rumbling? Something is different here. The shifter is unusual. Yikes!! What engine in this car? In short big Chevy with three speed automatic. Near stock brakes, no safety equipment, reasonable street tires, stock very old suspension, incredible play in the steering rack. understandably a very steep learning curve. Student had not read any books and no idea what a line was. I was only with him for one session. By the end of the day he was driving the line and using the car very well.

These are very well run events, and track time is definitely geared to the students in all groups through which would equate to our white group; although, many in their intermediate group are running at Black/Red performance levels. I went out with one of our red run group instructors in the intermediate group to sign him off for solo, very enjoyable. Let me say that there were some very, very well driven cars in the intermediate group. I intend to do more of these events.