SRF legal for a PCA/Potomac HPDE?

[Potomac-Greg]

I know this isn't an official PCA forum (and I have an email into the HPDE Chair at PCA-Potomac for an official response), but thought I would ask here if anyone knows if Spec Racer Ford would be allowed at a PCA HPDE. Specificially, the Summit Point event in a couple of weeks.

I looked at the tech form, and there are a couple of parameters that are hard to apply (e.g. windshield, wipers).

[smdubovsky]

Tell them its just like a 917/30:) No windshield or wipers there either.

[HateDCRoads]

I will defer to our tech chairs on the windshield and wipers, but a few things I do know:
1) It has to have fenders (which I think it does) - no open wheel cars
2) If it is an open car, you MUST have arm restraints that have not expired (they sell them at OG Racing)
3) Since it is single seat, I am assuming you are in an uninstructed run group (e.g., Whit, Black, Red?)

[Potomac-Greg]

I will defer to our tech chairs on the windshield and wipers, but a few things I do know:
1) It has to have fenders (which I think it does) - no open wheel cars
2) If it is an open car, you MUST have arm restraints that have not expired (they sell them at OG Racing)
3) Since it is single seat, I am assuming you are in an uninstructed run group (e.g., Whit, Black, Red?)

EDIT:

Got a response back from PCA. Looks like I'm good to go with White Group. Gotta rejoin PCA and register!

PS: Got fenders. Got arm restraints (per SCCA rules).

[Fairfax 944]

EDIT:

Got a response back from PCA. Looks like I'm good to go with White Group. Gotta rejoin PCA and register!

PS: Got fenders. Got arm restraints (per SCCA rules).

So, I'm going to see you at Porsche Fest next weekend? It's been a long time ole buddy. :)

[Potomac-Greg]

So, I'm going to see you at Porsche Fest next weekend? It's been a long time ole buddy. :)

I need one more approval from the highest authority. :shock:

[racer]

I've seen SRF's at other PCA events, but checking with the region you want to run with is key. One potential issue is that it may be difficult for you to give a passing signal as your arms are restrained.

[Potomac-Greg]

I've seen SRF's at other PCA events, but checking with the region you want to run with is key. One potential issue is that it may be difficult for you to give a passing signal as your arms are restrained.

I've done HPDEs and it is difficult, but I can make it pretty clear by "car language". And besides, who's going to pass me? :D

(I kid. On a good day, I'll run 1:26s, and I know there are plenty of ballar White Group guys who will top that.)

[HateDCRoads]

I need one more approval from the highest authority. :shock:

Still waiting on wifey, huh?

I've done HPDEs and it is difficult, but I can make it pretty clear by "car language". And besides, who's going to pass me? :D

(I kid. On a good day, I'll run 1:26s, and I know there are plenty of ballar White Group guys who will top that.)

You will need to be able to get a hand out the side to give a passing signal. You should be able to do this by adjusting your arm restraints, as there are other guys in the club who do so.

[HoodPin]

........You will need to be able to get a hand out the side to give a passing signal. You should be able to do this by adjusting your arm restraints, as there are other guys in the club who do so.

I suggest attaching a manequin's hand to the top of your helmet, and turning it appropriately. Maybe something like this....... :p

32568

[BlackTalon]

Lack of a windshield could make this a no-go. No wipers just means you probably won't drive if it rains, but no windshield is a different safety issue. The question has not filtered down to the Tech guys at this point, so I have not looked into it. But good chance it will be answered at a higher level.

[Carrera51]

No windshield? What about Ginther style 914s that have occasionally shown up at a Potomac DE?

[BlackTalon]

Not a formal answer here, but a couple items from * PCA National's * minimum DE standards:

Eye Protection: If the car does not have a windshield, the driver must be equipped with eye protection.

(That seems to imply no windshield is okay w/ National.)

Open Cars: Any make of car delivered with factory installed roll over protection meets the minimum standards for PCA DE events. In these cars the soft-top must be in the up position or the hard top installed. .

If a car does not have factory installed roll over protection, a roll bar or roll cage must be installed, which meets the "broomstick" rule (the driver's helmeted head is below a bar placed on top of the roll bar and windshield). Design, installation and materials of roll bars or cages and their installation must meet PCA Club Racing specifications, contained in Appendix A-Roll Cage Specifications of the PCA Club Racing Rules. All targa tops must be installed unless there is addition roll over protection. All sunroofs must be in the closed position. The windshield alone is not considered to be factory roll over protection.

(If full cage, just need to be sure helmet is below a line going from front-to-back of top cage members)

[BlackTalon]

From PCAP Potomac's Tech Form:

Arm Restraints and Face Shields:
Occupants in open-cockpit cars must have approved arm restraints and full face helmets with the shield in place. Targa bodied cars, 914s, and cabriolets must run with the top in place unless the occupants have arm restraints and full face helmets with shield in place. (Note: In any vehicle running without a full top, the structure at the B-pillar is considered to be a roll bar and must meet the roll bar height requirement (at least two inches (2”) above top of occupants’ helmets.)

[smdubovsky]

No wipers just means you probably won't drive if it rains

Eh? I ride the motorcycle in the rain. FWIW (to the non motorcycle/open-cockpit drovers) w/ the high curvature of the face shield its a non-issue at any kind of speed. If you do get droplets that 'stick' in the middle at slower speeds you just look left/right once in a while to blow them off. In stop/go you have to wipe it w/ your glove.

[BlackTalon]

Well, I just figured he probably wouldn't want to mess with swapping to 'wets', and would sit out a session if it was raining :lol:

[Potomac-Greg]

Not a formal answer here, but a couple items from * PCA National's * minimum DE standards:

Eye Protection: If the car does not have a windshield, the driver must be equipped with eye protection.

(That seems to imply no windshield is okay w/ National.)

Open Cars: Any make of car delivered with factory installed roll over protection meets the minimum standards for PCA DE events. In these cars the soft-top must be in the up position or the hard top installed. .

If a car does not have factory installed roll over protection, a roll bar or roll cage must be installed, which meets the "broomstick" rule (the driver's helmeted head is below a bar placed on top of the roll bar and windshield). Design, installation and materials of roll bars or cages and their installation must meet PCA Club Racing specifications, contained in Appendix A-Roll Cage Specifications of the PCA Club Racing Rules. All targa tops must be installed unless there is addition roll over protection. All sunroofs must be in the closed position. The windshield alone is not considered to be factory roll over protection.

(If full cage, just need to be sure helmet is below a line going from front-to-back of top cage members)

The broomstick rule is tough to apply. There's no front windshield or front roll hoop. But I think I'm sorted out with DE Chair in any event. What's amazing is that when the SRF was first raced, the roll hoop was lower (look at the lower of the two hoops behind my head). They made a "tall man" modification a few years into the program. Sometimes I wish they had a "taller man" mod.

http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a1cf06b3127ccefee258897a9400000030O08AbOG7lq5ZNA e3nwI/cC/f%3D0/ps%3D50/r%3D0/rx%3D720/ry%3D480/

[joep]

Not a formal answer here, but a couple items from * PCA National's * minimum DE standards:

Open Cars: Any make of car delivered with factory installed roll over protection meets the minimum standards for PCA DE events. In these cars the soft-top must be in the up position or the hard top installed. .



Is there more to qualify this about the height of the driver with helmet in relation to the height of the "factory installed" roll over protection? Otherwise this language seems to contradict the broomstick rule so long as the vehicle was stock. :?

[BlackTalon]

Yes -- well at least PCA Potomac does. It's on the Tech form.

[BMAN]

Hope to see it out there!

[Potomac-Greg]

Almost there! The car is approved for the event. I reactivated my PCA membership online yesteray, got my PCA member ID today, which allowed me to log into PCA-Potomac and register as a user there, which got me access to the HPDE registration page where I had to sign up to get access to HPDE registration, which is pending registrar approval, which should be really soon!!!

[Trak Ratt]

... which got me access to the HPDE registration page where I had to sign up to get access to HPDE registration, which is pending registrar approval, which should be really soon!!!Ok a little clarification needed. PCA HPDCs are for novice drovers looking to maybe participate in DE or just get to know their cars better. Diver Education (DE) are track events with instructors, run groups, class room training... ok they do sound a lot alike but DE are what most go back to. HPDCs are usually only one time afairs and usually only held twice a year. Other groupds call thier DEs HPDCs but not PCA.

[HateDCRoads]

Ok a little clarification needed. PCA HPDCs are for novice drovers looking to maybe participate in DE or just get to know their cars better. Diver Education (DE) are track events with instructors, run groups, class room training... ok they do sound a lot alike but DE are what most go back to. HPDCs are usually only one time afairs and usually only held twice a year. Other groupds call thier DEs HPDCs but not PCA.

I think Greg was using the term "HPDE" which a lot of other clubs use to refer to "DE"

[John Clay]

HPDE is a pretty common term. High Performance Drivers Education. I guess with Porsche, the High Performance is just assumed.

[JVH944]

HPDE is a pretty common term. High Performance Drivers Education. I guess with Porsche, the High Performance is just assumed.

Says the 944 drover......... :D

(Pot calling the kettle black, I know. Figured it was coming from BT)

[ausgeflippt951]

HPDE is a pretty common term. High Performance Drivers Education. I guess with Porsche, the High Performance is just assumed.

Heh -- we called it HPDE out in the AZ regions.

[BlackTalon]

Says the 944 drover......... :D

(Pot calling the kettle black, I know. Figured it was coming from BT)Hey, thanks for covering for me. Been out at meetings and inspections all day. I owe you one! :lol:

[Potomac-Greg]

Registered! See you's there.

[Fairfax 944]

I need one more approval from the highest authority. :shock:

Uh, you have jumped through a lot of hoops (and roll bars) to get registered, congrats! But you have never stated that the highest authority (which all of us who are married must answer to) has granted you permission. ;)

[Trak Ratt]

I think Greg was using the term "HPDE" which a lot of other clubs use to refer to "DE"Sure and you and I know that but not everyone will....

Don't care what they call a cow patty out west let alone a DE :p

[HateDCRoads]

Sure and you and I know that but not everyone will....

Don't care what they call a cow patty out west let alone a DE :p

Hey DR- where is the full size of your latest avatar?

[Potomac-Greg]

Sure and you and I know that but not everyone will....

Don't care what they call a cow patty out west let alone a DE :p

DE means Delaware. :)